Ep. 24: Trust Your Knowing_ A New Era of Leadership with Jessica Papineau, Elyse Archer & Michelle Chalfant
Three powerhouse women walk into a podcast… and something electric happens. This episode introduces the J.E.M. Collective—Jessica, Elyse, and Michelle—and the origin story behind their magnetic new collaboration.
In this conversation, I sit down with three women who are each a movement on their own—and together, they are a force. This episode explores how Jessica Papineau (style strategist), Elyse Archer (sales + wealth mentor), and Michelle Chalfant (global teacher + creator of The Adult Chair®️) felt an undeniable energetic pull to join forces.
We dive into the moment the “triangle lightning bolt” hit them, how they learned to trust their inner knowing, and why leading with feminine energy, intuition, and presence is the future of leadership.
You’ll hear the deeply personal stories behind their own transformations—burnout, reinvention, dismantling old identities, and reclaiming their power. You’ll also get a first look at what they’re building next: a high-caliber mastermind for women who are ready to burn down what no longer serves them and create an empire rooted in truth, alignment, and impact.
What You’ll Hear in This Episode:
✔️The origin story of the J.E.M. Collective and the moment everything clicked
✔️Why intuitive leadership is the next evolution of feminine power
✔️What it actually feels like to follow your knowing—even when it makes no logical sense
✔️How childhood, family dynamics, and conditioning disconnect us from our inner wisdom
✔️Why becoming your next-level self requires dismantling former identities
✔️An exclusive preview of their new Empire Mastermind for 2026
If this episode sparked something inside you, share it with a friend who needs this conversation today.
And if you want support navigating your own pivot, grab the Heart-Aligned Career Transition Starter https://www.leadintact.com/freebies/heart-aligned-career
or
book a free 20-minute call at https://leadintactwithlaura.as.me/free-consultation
To connect with each amazing woman or learn more about the upcoming Empire Mastermind:
Jessica’s Website and Social Media Handles:
Website: (https://csjstyling.com/)
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thejessicapapineau
Facebook: CSJ Styling
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/thejessicapapineau/
Elyse’s website and social media:
Website: https://elysearcher.com/
IG: https://www.instagram.com/elysearcher
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/elysearcher/
To listen to previous episode with Elyse: https://open.spotify.com/episode/5pdVOeygiPDmPKW2pg42k3?si=1K-4vEgiTJSZy0uHvNjDYw
Michelle’s website and social media:
Website: www.theadultchair.com
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/themichellechalfant
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/michelle-chalfant/
To learn more about the Empire Mastermind: www.theempiremastermind.com
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You are listening to the pivot point where we unpack the defining moments that shift careers and lives. I'm your host, Laura Dionicio, a founder of Lead Intacct, and my mission is to spotlight the raw real stories behind career pivots, the fears, the hopes. The messy middles and the bold decisions that follow if you're feeling stuck or quietly wondering what's next?
I hope these stories help you see yourself a little more clearly and inspire you to start moving toward your own dream life. Let's begin.
Laura D: Welcome to the Pivot Point Podcast. I have Jessica, I have Elyse, and I have Michelle, the J.E.M. Collective. I'm so excited to have the three of you here. Side note, I kind of made up the J.E.M. acronym and I'm just gonna keep saying it. Un un until I hope that it, it sticks well. We will see. Thank you so much for being here.
Laura D: I have a fun merged bio that the three of you have not heard, and I would love to introduce you using the J.E.M. Collective merged bio. Okay. Individually, they're forces together. They're a whole movement. Elyse Archer, Michelle Chalfant and Jessica Papineau are three women who don't just break mold, they build new ones.
Laura D: Each of them has spent years transforming lives in her own lane, and now they're coming together to create something even more magnetic aligned and world shifting. Elyse is the mind behind Superhuman Selling and the She Sells movement. The woman who turned the sales world on its head by proving you can lead with heart intuition and authenticity and multiplier income a three times Salesforce top sales influencer, international keynote speaker, and host of Superhuman Selling.
Laura D: She empowers entrepreneurs to unlock quantum leaps by selling in a way that actually feels like them. Michelle is the therapist turned global teacher whose Adult Chair model has helped millions understand themselves, heal their patterns, and finally feel at home in their own lives. A bestselling author, host of the Michelle Chalfant show 11 million plus downloads.
Laura D: Hey, and creator of a thriving international coaching certification. She blends psychology and spirituality in a way that's both. Deeply human and wildly transformative. Jessica is the style alchemist behind CSJ styling. The woman high achieving leaders call when the ready to be seen with 25 plus years in the fashion industry.
Laura D: She styled everyone from seven figure founders to execs of billion dollar brands. Not to quote unquote look good, but to become. Who they're meant to be. Her philosophy, style is strategy, image is impact. And when a woman feels aligned in her skin. Magic happens. These three trailblazers are on their own missions to help people sell with soul, live with authenticity, and show up in the world fully expressed.
Laura D: But now they're weaving their expertise together to create something bigger than any one lane. Something that helps women rise from the inside out. Nervous system, mindset, style, presence, wealth and energy. All working together. This isn't collaboration for collaboration's sake. This is a power triad of women who've mastered their craft, built global communities, and changed countless lives.
Laura D: Now choosing to combine their brilliance to spark the next era of feminine leadership alignment and impact individually, they elevate. Together, they ignite. Welcome, J.E.M..
jessica: Thank you, Laura. Oh my goodness.
Elyse Archer: feel like we are in a, I feel like we need to do a girl band together. I love that you clarified. Jen Collective is something you came up with, but I feel like we're in a girl band and
Elyse Archer: Intro
Laura D: yes. I will follow you around introducing you. No problem. Like I'm okay with that.
Elyse Archer: Hair hype woman, please.
Laura D: am a hype woman. Yeah. So what I would just love to start with is. I cannot tell you how excited I am when I first heard that the three of you are doing something. I don't know what that something is. Y'all, by the way, listeners, that's why I was like, get on my podcast.
Laura D: I wanna be the first to know, you know? But also, like both Elyse and Michelle know that I have, uh, Jessica, if I had your number, I would've done this too. I have been messaging them. Emailing them and I was just like, listen, I just feel something here. Please do something. And so, I mean, I'm not gonna take credit, but I'm so happy that the three of you're coming together.
Laura D: I would love to hear about how that started. Even
Laura D: it was my bugging.
Elyse Archer: Oh my gosh.
jessica: I think it, it all started, it probably started before we even knew it started, but I remember the moment that trio Energy all hit us like a lightning bolt. we were on actually Michelle, you were on a couch and Elyse and I were in chairs. And we were you were asking us questions for your podcast, Elyse, the three of us were doing a collaborative podcast in Orlando, Florida, and we were just I don't even know at what point it came to us, but this energy came through.
jessica: I felt it in my heart.
jessica: it in my heart space, and it was like a lightning bolt triangle that is the only way that I can describe it. And it was not specific. It was a feeling and it was an indescribable feeling. And I think when something is really big and really expansive and really magical. It's a feeling. It doesn't necessarily, it's not necessarily something that you can put into words. And I think it's so incredible that Elyse, Michelle and I are so tuned in and tapped in that we paid attention.
Elyse Archer: Yeah.
Elyse Archer: Can I if I can just build off of what you shared there, Jessica and Laura, I think that this is, you even hinted at this with what you were sharing before, and this is also really directly tied to what we're all doing together, is the coming back to your knowing, ever since I was connected with Michelle, which was AJ Vn at Brand Builders, and then Jessica, I got connected to you through Brand Builders too.
Elyse Archer: So shout out to them because it's fun. Just the origin story and how we have all been. Connected. And then Laura, I met you through Michelle. Obviously there's just been this knowing of there's meant to be something bigger and there's been little synchronicities all along the way. And Laura, even when you shared with how you were like text, texting and emailing oh my gosh, you guys need to do something together. There's. I think that we are all being called to really be guided by our knowing and our wisdom, our feminine wisdom and intuition. This doesn't have anything to do with gender. It's a feminine quality wisdom, intuition. As we go into this next year, and this is. Whenever you're listening to this, the message will hit you the right way.
Elyse Archer: But I think that the biggest and best things that we all build and create moving forward, whether in our business or in our lives, it's gonna be very heavily guided by inner knowing, not analytical mind, not mapping out. A 10 step plan on paper, but going back to your knowing, and that's something that I think has guided our partnership, our relationships, how we're here today.
Elyse Archer: And I think that it's something we're all being invited to deepen into as we go into this next chapter is what is your knowing? And the more that we trust that, the more that we allow that to lead the right steps fall into place. So it's been very intuitively guided, very. Based on knowing, and I think that's what we're wanting to bring into the world, probably more than ever right now. Yeah.
Laura D: I love that.
Laura D: Yeah, I think I was just one vehicle to have you pay attention. Like I was joking. I don't, I don't really take credit except for the J.E.M., uh, acronym.
Elyse Archer: That's good.
Laura D: I have a question.
Laura D: So the three of you talked about it's an inner knowing, it's not in your head, it's feminine wisdom.
Laura D: And I can just imagine the listener who was really me. Like not that long ago who's like, I don't understand what that means. And what I want the listener to know is. I also was like that Michelle knew me when I was like that. So I just wanna say like, it's not something that necessarily comes innately to everyone, but what I would love the listener to hear is what was your journey to tuning into that knowing and trusting it? Right? Because sometimes we're like, no, that can't be right. 'cause the logic doesn't make sense.
Michelle: You're saying just in life in general, not just in this J.E.M. collective that we have.
Laura D: Yes. Yes. Just because I want the listeners to understand, because it's so easy to see and feel your energy and be like, well, of course the three of them, and like.
jessica: Yeah.
Laura D: Why this podcast honestly means a lot to me is because I've been the person who would look at the three of you and be like, yes, them, not me.
Laura D: And I really, it's important to me to dive into like, no, these all of us are, are human and we had to also do some things to get here. And the hope is that they will be able to see themselves in your stories and start to trust themselves a little bit more. So I would love to hear your individual journeys.
jessica: Who wants can,
Elyse Archer: I
jessica: would it be okay if
Elyse Archer: first.
jessica: I'm good to go because I just got the hit. I talk to so many women that say, things to me like, oh my gosh, you've done so many things, Jessica, you've influenced so many people. Your life is has been so interesting and exciting, and. almost like people saying that to me in a way that they think that I've had unique opportunities that other people haven't had. so I wanna speak to that a little bit because I think so many, and I'm gonna say women because that's really who I serve as the high, high-performing woman. And she continuously wants to grow. She wants more for herself. Sometimes what I hear her say is, the opportunity just hasn't happened yet, and what I've found, what I've discovered in my life is that my life isn't any different. Yes, it's different everyone. We all have our unique lives, but when you can really tap in, tune in and pay attention, which I have always innately done, and I, I. credit to my upbringing for that. Really being like shut off from the outside world in that, we didn't have television and no electricity, no running water.
jessica: We had to like literally live off the land. So I believe I was more tapped in because of that, and I've always paid attention. And when those things come up, when I get the intuitive hit, even when I was 16 years old and I was in the backwoods of Maine and I got this intuitive hit that. In order for me to have an opportunity to live the life I wanted to live, I had to take radical change and pay attention and go and live in a city in a new country in Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada. Go and live with a dad that I did not have a good relationship or a close relationship with, because I wanted opportunity to expand my life and live a life where I could really show other women how to step into their power and how to utilize. I knew this at 16, how to utilize clothing to amplify their voice to really, show up in their full power.
jessica: I knew that. And had I not that's maybe like my first big decision or first opportunity that I created myself. But that has been my experience my entire life. So sitting on that couch that day, feeling that feeling and this feeling amplifies as you pay attention and as you do the thing. so it was amplified in that moment for me.
jessica: And that's really the. The way that I could describe it, I could tell many stories, but
Elyse Archer: Yeah.
jessica: have other people on this podcast to
Laura D: Yeah I love that. And you know what I took from your experience, Jessica 'cause some people, listeners might be like, oh, I didn't grow up that way, but what I took away is you were shut off from technology. We all can make a choice to do that and get out and like really disconnect from time to time.
Laura D: So I think that's something that listeners can do like at the end of this episode. If you wanna pause right now and do it and see what comes up, you can do that too. And what I also love from your story is you said you, you made the radical change. You decided, I'm getting goosebumps. You decided to make the radical change.
Laura D: And unlike the no-knock to whoever said this, like the women who have come to you and said, I'm just waiting for the opportunity. You didn't wait. You said you created the opportunity. I think that's so. Powerful and that no matter where you are in your career, in your life, you can do at least those two things shut off from your technology for however long, decide to make a radical change, and that's how you create your opportunities.
Laura D: So thank you Jessica, for that. Oh my God. We're only like, I don't know, 20 minutes in and it's like so good already. Okay. Elyse or Michelle, who would like to go next?
Elyse Archer: Michelle
Laura D: Michelle. A hand up.
Michelle: for me, I don't even remember the exact question. What was the exact question? Because I know what I wanna say, but what was the question?
Laura D: you're welcome to, to say what you wanna share. But just because you asked the question. Yeah. The question was what was your journey to connect into your knowing? I.
Michelle: Thank you. So the journey for me was because I kept thinking it was my heart. I kept thinking of Jessica's talking. I was like, it was my heart. It was my heart. It was my heart. I really believe as humans, we're all born really connected to our heart, to what we're feeling. And if we're able to stay connected to that place, what we realize is that's what guides us in life. However, most of us aren't for living in that space. We're praised for living what I call chin up. You know, what do you know? What do you think you know? How much knowledge can you gain? And we start losing that connection, not just with the heart, but sometimes even with the body. And for me, I went down a similar path.
Michelle: I grew up, as a little kid growing, coming into the world as what they call an empath, which is somebody that can not only feel my emotions, but everyone else's around me. So it was overwhelming to feel so many emotions, and I learned to turn that down and at some point, turn it off. And then what I learned to do was to come back to that space of the heart and learn how to filter out other people. Learn how to stay more connected to myself and listen, and it sounds weird, like listen to your heart, but I firmly believe, and I know that when we listen to the whispers, and sometimes the heart doesn't usually yell, ego will yell, but the heart doesn't yell. It waits. It's very patient, it whispers.
Michelle: And if we're willing to get quiet and listen, it really does guide. It will guide you along the way. And I had to learn to do that to kind of come back to the heart space. And a lot of it was when. I think about being in high school and college, that was when I was like kind of dis very disconnected from myself. But people would always come to me for some reason. Like, can you help me? You know, I've got this going on. I'm like, sure. And what I found was when I was able to help other people, I wasn't answering from my head, I was answering from my heart. They, they were able to transform. They were able, this is like in high school and college by the way.
Michelle: And I was like, wow, that information coming from? And what I learned over the many, many years now is that. The information that comes from the heart is different from the head and I, I learned to trust the heart. And fast forward. Now again, it's by the way, 3 33, I'm just gonna say 3, 3, 3. sitting with these three beautiful the three of us sitting together on that couch in Elyse's podcast, it was our heart that all of three of us, it, something came alive and we paid attention. And here's the thing. We didn't even know what it was. And that's, that's where people get stumped or stopped is they say, this feels right, but it doesn't make any sense, so I'm not gonna do it. felt right for us. And we paid attention we waited for the next hit the next download the next, you know, the next, you know, our, the heart speaks to us if we're, if we're willing to listen.
Michelle: So had to learn that, you know, from going from heart connected to disconnected back to connected again. And I just keep paying attention and beautiful, beautiful collaborations like this unfold even with you, Laura. Beautiful things happen. You know, I think about my podcast when I was like, hmm. Oh, I'm gonna change the name from the adult chair to something else.
Michelle: This is a year, year ago. People would ask me, oh, what are you changing it to? And I said, I don't know what, ha, it's not here yet. They're like, what do you mean? I'm like, my heart will tell me, but I can tell you, my heart is saying it's time for a change. I just dunno what it is. And people would look at me like, what are you talking about?
Michelle: I'm like, Nope. I trust the heart. It's gonna, it will deliver the information right on time. And, and it did. And it does. And that's why we're all sit sitting here with you today. So for me it was a lot about the heart and really connecting more deeply into the heart. And yeah, and that has been an incredible journey and it just keeps getting better every day for sure.
Laura D: Yeah. For the listeners who this is like new language for them and trust me, like Michelle can attest to this was me, this, I did not understand what heart meant. I was like, what is that? Uh, an emoji. Just pay attention. Pay attention right now. Like as you were speaking, even Jessica, when you were speaking, I could feel the truth of what Michelle was saying in my heart and I could physically feel.
Laura D: My heart expanding. So for the listener where this is new and you get into your head and you're like, wait, I don't get it. That's what Michelle was saying. It's different. You don't have to get it, quote unquote pay attention. Like how does it feel right now as you're listening to these amazingly powerful, talented, beautiful women speak.
Laura D: So thank you, Michelle.
Michelle: Just
Laura D: you. Have
Michelle: Of
Laura D: hmm.
Michelle: You. But just asking yourself, for anyone that is listening that's, that's asking the question that you're saying like, wait, what does that mean? Just begin this daily practice of asking yourself, how does that make me feel? Whatever it is. We're gonna go to dinner tonight and get Chi Chinese, let's say.
Michelle: How does that make me feel? It's amazing. It's a new muscle that you're gonna start using and the more you start asking yourself, and then you drop your attention below your chin into the center of your chest. Notice, like Laura was saying, you either open or close and you'll feel a pull or you won't feel a pull.
Michelle: You'll feel contracted, or that's a no. An opening is a yes, so just start paying attention. We all have this muscle. Every human, but we're on a practice and anybody can learn how to practice this. It's a skill and it becomes something you don't even have to practice after you do it a few times, so.
Laura D: That's true. Thank you, Michelle. What about you, Elyse? What was your journey to the knowing?
Elyse Archer: Yes. Oh my gosh. I love hearing both of you ladies share 'cause I relate so much to what you both shared. It's funny, the core message, my brand on the outside is about selling and money and expansion, but the core message of the brand is actually trust yourself. Because learning how to trust yourself again, how to trust myself again after years, if not completely transformed my life.
Elyse Archer: So the very Abridge Cliff's Notes version of time we have today is I was someone who. Shut off her inner knowing early on. And I think that many of us have that experience, whether like Michelle, you mentioned being an empath and feeling everything, or whether it's childhood trauma or whatever it is.
Elyse Archer: I shut, I felt everything very strongly early and shut that off 'cause it felt like too much and learned to live in a mold that kept me safe, navigating through the world. grew up in a household that was very, analytical, very praised for academic performance. Both my parents were like Ivy League grads and really like super smart. And so learned to, like Michelle said, live neck up and I found myself in my late twenties having pursued everything that I thought was gonna make me happy and successful. The corporate job. A marriage certain type of house and car and on the outside kind of looking like I had it all together. And yet on the inside I felt completely broken, crippled, struggling with panic attacks, eating disorder, constant anxiety about everything in my life. And, I think that's maybe someone's listening and they're going through that right now, or they can relate to a time in their life where they had done that, where they hadn't listened to their inner knowing for so long. And it was actually at that time that I discovered podcasting because I was driving. Really long distance from my outside sales job at the time. And I didn't wanna have to sit with my inner voice because it was so loud, but it was telling me I had to change everything in my life and it felt so scary and daunting. So I was like, I'm gonna listen to something I discovered podcasting.
Elyse Archer: And so anyway long story short. Through podcasting, discovered personal development, discovered it started going down a very spiritual path, a very different path than I'd been on before. Started learning how to listen to myself and my inner knowing. Again, made a lot of changes that felt very scary and uncomfortable.
Elyse Archer: Left the marriage, left the jobs, launched a business, left. Everything behind that I knew. But it transformed my life and it. Positioned me to be able to trust my inner knowing. I learned how to listen to myself again through doing that, was able to turn my annual income into my monthly income in a really short amount of time.
Elyse Archer: Get out of struggle with the eating disorder, the panic attacks, all the things. And that is, to me, that's the core of. Business success today, sales success and life success is knowing how to trust yourself. And both Michelle and Jessica said, when you're guided that way, which is something we wanna encourage all women to do through the work we're doing together now when you're guided that way, it doesn't make logical sense.
Elyse Archer: It doesn't make analytical sense on paper, it will not make sense, and you get to trust it. You get to trust your inner knowing that's telling you, go here, do this thing. And it's, Steve Jobs talked about. You'll connect the dots looking backwards. That's the wisdom of the heart. That's the guidance of the heart, and it is feminine energy, which I think we're all being called to lean into more at this time on the planet as well, versus the masculine.
Elyse Archer: I've gotta have it all logical, linear,
jessica: Yeah.
Elyse Archer: ahead. So yeah, there you go.
Laura D: I love that. And you know, something that, that's struck me as like, I relate so much to that story about like being a high performer and looking like you have everything from the outside and like the panic attacks and all. Like, I, I. Vividly remember that. And what I would love if you could expand a little bit more for the listener who hasn't quite gotten there.
Laura D: 'cause my goal, honestly, in this podcast is like, if I can prevent someone from getting to that point, like I would've loved that. 'cause that doesn't feel good. So I, I would love if you could expand a little bit more on like, what was that? A like for you, like, did you have a breaking point and what would you say to the younger you to be like, Hey, maybe we can try this whole inner knowing thing.
Laura D: It may not make logical sense, but you're like, what would you say?
Elyse Archer: Yeah. You want me to answer that one or is
Laura D: Actually any, yeah, if any, anyone.
Elyse Archer: yeah. I'll just share and then I'll invite you ladies to to please chime in.
Elyse Archer: Yeah, for me it was, it was right before my 28th birthday that I decided to be done with the whole thing and find a different way of living. And for me, 20 eighth's, just my number.
Elyse Archer: Like I see them everywhere. It's, it's my little sign. It's my, like my angel number. and I remember right before my 28th birthday looking at my life and it was. So out of alignment, but I didn't even really know what alignment was. I just knew I wasn't happy. I knew I had done all the things I thought I was supposed to do, and yet everything felt off. And I said, I will not go into this 1 28 year that I get in this lifetime, in this body, with the same set of circumstances that feels so off and so wrong. And I don't know what's on the other side of it, but. The pain of making a lot of changes is maybe less than the pain of staying where I am with things.
Elyse Archer: And so I think we've all had those moments where we really step out in faith and do the things that feel scary. But again, to what both Jessica and Michelle said, when you're following that knowing of your heart, it may involve disentangling some things. It may involve some painful transitions and changes, but it's what's on the other side is for you. It is your next level of truth. It is aligned.
jessica: Yeah.
Elyse Archer: what I would say
jessica: Yeah. I had a moment. I definitely had a moment as well. Very spec. I like remember it, very vividly and what my surroundings were and everything that, that moment that I decided, I'm gonna take a really, really big leap this time, like bigger than I've ever taken before. But I really think, I think a lot of people that are listening may be asking themselves, okay, I understand this feminine energy this.
jessica: Heart space thing, but then what? But then what do I do with that? And so I remember this feeling in my heart of knowing that there was something bigger that was meant for me. And, but then, those limiting beliefs come in and go, oh, that's. Selfish or, oh, I have a family that I need to make sure my family's okay.
jessica: And if I made this decision, at the time I was working at a clothing boutique. I had been there for eight years. I was maxed out at how much I could make in a year. I think the highest number I got to. Was, I think it was 80 grand. And I remember like thinking, how am I ever gonna do that again or duplicate that again, Elyse.
jessica: I know. I was talking about that the other day. We discussed that and I remember thinking, how in the world could I do something on my own and even be able to scratch the surface of what 80 grand could be? And so with that inner knowing, I was actually, I think God, universe Source puts us in situations at certain times for us to hear things on the outside, outside of ourselves to jolt us and get us to pay attention. And I was at a stoplight. And at this stoplight, when I would go into work every day and I had also started listening to podcasts. It was my way of getting my head into a good. Space before I went into a world and a space where people were very of lack and we had to fight and kick and scream for our clients and make the money and all of this stuff.
jessica: And so I was listening to this podcast and stopped at a stoplight with this like whisper that had been happening, this inner knowing something more for me. But my head was coming in and saying, oh, that's selfish, or you won't be able to support your family. we needed both of our incomes. And then the person that was doing the podcast, and this was, it was actually Tony Robbins, my hero, Tony, and Tony was speaking to me as I was at this stoplight. And Tony said, when you have a knowing and a gift that you know. That you were given, And that it could really change and transform someone else's life. But you choose not to fully lean into it. You're actually a selfish person. And I thought, oh my gosh, Tony, you are right. are right. So it requires, so this is transformation. So we can transform in a moment and in this moment, what I believed to be true before that moment realized was an actual lie. It wasn't the truth. It wasn't my truth anymore. And from that point forward, I was able to make an expansive decision without being attached to any of the outcomes. And so here's the other piece. So you drop into your heart space. You have the knowing, right? You realize the old parts of you and old beliefs have to die, and then you have to do something even bigger.
jessica: You have to surrender. Surrender the outcome, because when you tap in and tune into your heart space, and you are not attached to outcomes. very paradoxical, really as a high performer, but when you don't attach to it and you lean into the power of what your heart is telling you, you have abilities.
jessica: You have super human abilities. So like the three of us doing something together, we know we all have the knowing not just for ourselves, but we have the knowing of us collectively that. What we are meant to do is bigger than us. It's more powerful than us and other women need this power. And so over the course of the last however many months a year, we have fostered our relationship not knowing the exact of what it is, but it has grown and developed and it's.
jessica: now becoming,
Laura D: Oh my God.
jessica: leaders are craving what we have. They are craving it. They're craving transformation. But this is not for the faint of heart ladies.
jessica: This is not for the faint of heart because this requires a dismantling and a shedding of old beliefs that are not true. They're all a lie, need to rebuild a foundation with our knowing and tapping into that.
Michelle: Mm-hmm. Amen.
Laura D: Oh my.
Michelle: Amen.
Laura D: Oh my God. You know what I love? Love. I know that's it. I'm kidding. There's more to come.
Laura D: Listeners, what I love about what you said is because here's the thing that I've noticed for myself as I'm on social media or I'm talking to friends, that sometimes we get into yeah, the knowing and it feels good and it feels good in my heart.
Laura D: What I love that you said though, Jessica, is that it requires dismantling, it requires your old self to die. It requires you to rebuild, and I think that's. Really important to highlight and especially it requires you to not be of the faint of heart and to like really surrender. Because I think sometimes these days, especially like I, I'm so happy that some of this verbiage is more like becoming the vernacular, but sometimes I feel like there's a little bit of spiritual bypassing going on and that it's like, oh, it should feel good, like the heart, whatever.
Laura D: Michelle's nodding her head. So say more about that. Michelle. You feel deeply about this. I felt it. 'cause I have a heart now I can. I did. I get it now. I get it. It took a while.
Michelle: I mean, I just, again, at going from Elyse to Jessica to, I, I couldn't agree more with both of them. And I think about. The journey that we take just in being human. I'm just gonna go really high level. We're just being human.
Michelle: It can be so hard sometimes, even if like, like you were saying, like, well, I'm following my heart, but why does it feel so hard and scary? I know way back when, when the person I was with said, oh, you should start a podcast. This isn't 2014. I'm like. And I was like, yeah, sure. Okay. And I was following my heart and it was all going well and the company and I went from, you know, seeing clients one-on-one to the podcast and everything started to grow. then what I found was when I started really building, I don't know, the second company, I think it was 2019 to 23, it was growing, I, I was feeling there was something off and there needed to be a dismantling to continue to scale. And it was the scariest, the scariest, the most. It was sad, it was hard.
Michelle: It was, so much grief. There was so much transformation for myself in elation, and I can't even tell you where I am now. I see it now, but sometimes we have to go through really, really, really hard things in order to become the person we're here to become, I'm so grateful for that entire experience.
Michelle: I would not trade it for anything. I learned so much about myself. I learned about scaling, I learned about business, I learned about leadership. Like the list goes on and on and on and on. So, yes. Follow your heart. Yes. Follow your intuition. Yes. It, it's hard sometimes, and it's really hard sometimes.
Michelle: I dismantled my whole company. I had to let everybody go because my heart was telling me to, my brain was like, are you out of your mind? How are you gonna move forward? I go, I don't even know. I, I don't know. And I'm terrified, and it's the right thing to do. So. Yeah, I, I, it's been the greatest thing and that's when we come together, the three of us, this is what we've talked about so much, is that we've gone through so much of the hard stuff, like really, really, really hard stuff.
Michelle: We can see it. We know what it looks like. We've walked through it. We wanna help you, like we wanna help. People that are in the middle of that same kind of transition, that are wondering like, how do I scale? How do I grow this company? What the heck's going on? There's something not right. What is the block?
Michelle: It's like we can probably smell it a mile away because we've walked that path, right? We've walked that path and, and it's scary and it will be wonderful when you reach the other side. It will absolutely be wonderful. So.
jessica: Yeah.
Laura D: Yeah. And I would love Michelle if you could give a little bit more context, because I was there for the dismantling and like I, I'm familiar. But for the listeners who weren't there, who aren't familiar,
Michelle: mm-hmm.
Laura D: us about like what. What you had going on at the time when you decided I am dismantling everything.
Laura D: Just so like they can understand. No, when, when Michelle says it was scary, like,
Michelle: was terrifying.
Laura D: and it wasn't that long ago too.
Michelle: no, it was two, two years ago, this, this month actually. But I also knew it was the right thing to do. I could feel it. I could really, really feel it. And And it was the inner voice. The downloads were like, you have to do this. And I was like, what? No. And I had heard it probably for a year before, to be honest with you, but it came to a head like two, two years ago. I had a whole two coaching programs, a membership. I was seeing clients. I mean, it was like I had the podcast, I had everything going on, writing a book in the middle of writing a book, and I knew the level of talk. We've been talking today a lot about feminine energy. We've been talking about divine feminine, and what the hell does that mean?
Michelle: Honestly, a lot of people are probably listening going, I don't even know what that means. Let me just give you. To just this one example. It's the divine masculine in us or the toxic masculinity that says, grind it out, work hard, work a million hours a day. Be anxious. That is unhealthy energy. And that was my old company. We were working all the time. So many hours a day. We, and it was this mentality of, and I hate to say it, but the world was, well, at least the United States was like that. harder, I mean, I remember when people would ask me to lunch and I'd say, can you believe they asked me to go to lunch? I work full-time.
Michelle: Like I have a company. I can't go to lunch. I was like offended that they would, a people in my town here would ask me my friends, and I realized how outta balance that was. And grinding it out and working these hours. And my team was, I wasn't even forcing them, but I realized you tracked what you are, you know, we all were attracted to each other and we all were working like that.
Michelle: And the girls that worked with me were saying, so anxious. I'm like, well, this doesn't feel right to me. And I'm anxious too, and I don't like it. had to be, I knew it had to be changed and I, and I, I think about. The plane was built and I wanted it to soar, and it would not, there was no way it could soar the way the plane was built, just as, as a analogy here, so, or so, that's what I had to do, and I kept hearing this voice.
Michelle: I remember heard this voice in the shower one day when I was really in deep contemplation about dismantling the company the way it was. And I said, I, I think I have to let everybody go. I'm letting everybody go. This isn't right. There's something is really off. And I kept saying, I feel like. I'm driving a car and I have one flat tire, but I'm going really fast and I'm not taking the time to change it.
Michelle: That one tire that's really flat, there's no air left and we kept pushing. Well just, you know, if you can go faster, it'll be okay. You won't even notice. It's like, no, I was noticing and I was in the shower one day and I said, was just sitting there washing my hair and I said, there's no way. I can do this.
Michelle: I have a coaching program in two months. Like there's no way I can let everybody go. And I said, I really need, but I knew where the company was going. It wasn't healthy. And I, I was just talking to myself in the shower and I said, okay. I said, okay, God, universe, you've gotta help me turn the Titanic around.
Michelle: Please help me because this doesn't feel good the where it's going. And I could you not clear is a be I heard the words, we don't want you to turn the Titanic around. We want you to sink it and climb into a, a catamaran and fly. I was like, whoa. Like it was so just out of left field and I was like, okay, there's my queue. yeah. give you a lot more details, but I know for the sake of time. But yeah,
Laura D: Yeah.
Michelle: so let everybody go. And again, this is where the trust is next level, and it was so freaking hard and I had to trust that this was the right process. My heart was telling me so, and my head was having a nervous breakdown.
Michelle: I was like, what? Are you out of your mind? I was like, Nope. one by one the right people. Out of, when I say out of left field, out of the blue, started showing up saying, oh, you're hiring, oh, I, I've always wanted to work with you, or I used to work with you. Can you know, are you looking for any? I was like, yes.
Michelle: Can you start like tomorrow or next week? I'd love to. I just ended this other job. I was like. Get out,
jessica: Yeah.
Michelle: go. So that's how it happened for me. And I again, wouldn't trade it for anything. And I still loved my old I, I loved all those girls on my old team. They were amazing humans and it was time for all of us to part ways and go our separate ways. And I have no hard feelings about any of it. And I'm so happy where I am today. It's a great solid company. Now we're, while we're flying and it feels amazing.
Laura D: Yeah. The reason I asked about that, Michelle, is just because I was like, you're brushing away things, but I was there.
Michelle: You
Laura D: I saw it. I felt it. I was right there. And so when I tell you listeners that I had the privilege of watching this unfold and. This is why I have these three. 'cause I've had the privilege at this point to, to know a little bit.
Laura D: Like I've known Michelle the longest, obviously, but like when I tell you, they're not just blowing smoke up, you know what the saying is, I'm not gonna finish it. But, um, really, I saw it happen. I saw her certainty. I saw Michelle just, just lean into her knowing, and I watched it all unfold. And listener, if you're like me and you're like, uh, it hurts, but like.
Laura D: Watching it for other people. And you have to realize that it's possible for you too. That's important. And so, so with that, I really wanna hear, 'cause the three of these ladies are like powerhouses and I just, I'm, I've been in the edge of my seat. Can we hear a little bit about what's to come? Is now the time to talk about it?
Laura D: You can see, can we hear a little something going?
Michelle: A little nugget or two maybe
Laura D: A little. Little What? What do we have to look forward to? A, anything that you would love to share.
Michelle: we're birth. The three of us are birthing a baby.
jessica: Yeah, we're birthing a baby. the first thing I want if it's okay, Laura, I wanna share a little bit about who this woman is that we're calling in because we're calling her in and she's ready for us. And it's a very special specific and she's a leader and she's, she is, she has a, knowing that this is a new era of leadership. She wants to figure it out. She wants to figure it out. She's been trying to figure it out. She's been going over here and she has a coach here and you know she's going to retreats and she's having these transformations, but nothing's changed for her yet. Maybe her income's changed. Maybe she's on the leaderboard.
jessica: She is doing, she's made a little bit more money. She's enjoying her family a little bit more, but she craving something more. She is craving I am going to call transformation. And transformation is a word now that's thrown around. And let's really just talk about what transformation is and what this woman that we're calling in, what she really desires is to dismantle. She wants to burn it down. She's worked her whole life to get to where she is, and she wants to burn it down because she is redefining leadership and she's redefining success. And so we, the three of us, we have been. Called, I know I'm gonna sound super passionate here, but we have been called because in order to have true transformation it requires a complete dismantling, a complete blow it up, and then it requires a building, a strong foundation of which we can work towards. Be pulled towards something that is so powerful that can happen very quickly when done the right way. But this requires three different things to happen. This is an outside in, inside out process. This isn't just about. Heart and changing your heart, changing your belief system, going back to your knowing really, dismantling what we believe to be true.
jessica: Knowing now that it's not true, blowing it up, changing everything. If we want the women that are, we're calling in. Want sustainability with their transformation. They want sustainability with how they are leading, and they desire to lead in a way that is in full alignment with their heart, their soul, and everything they desire. And so I, that is at high level. I'm gonna let somebody else get in here and talk nitty gritty, but high level, that is the woman. So whoever is listening, if you're in a place in your life where you've done all the things. You've done all of it. You've led with, conviction, you've been on leaderboards, you have people outside of you saying you are the best of the best.
jessica: You're incredible, but inside you feel disconnected to self and you want more, and you just can't. Fathom what it looks like to be there and the how of, how to get there. And that's what we're here to do, is to give that roadmap and to guide women through a, a real, true transformational experience that sustainable, where true joy, daily joy, a daily practice of joy can really happen and it is possible.
Elyse Archer: I'm so excited. Can I do you ladies mind? Can I share the
jessica: You share the nitty gritty girl. Get in there.
Elyse Archer: This is called the Empire Mastermind, and so this is
Elyse Archer: Select, curated group of women who are. Unapologetically committed to building their empire as we go into 2026 and beyond. And I think that Jessica, everything that you shared there about releasing what no longer serves, I think that each of us has probably been going through that some this year, the woman, and it, it is like, it's doesn't feel good in the moment, but I tell you what, when you are. Building your empire. And each of us, Jessica, like you said, it, it feels like we have been asked to do this. This has been like divinely ordained. I can't even explain the way it's all come together. It's just, we just, we know we're meant to do this. 'cause there's women out there who need it. When you are. Building your empire, and you get to define what that means for you, whether it's a certain financial amount in your business, a certain amount of time freedom, a certain amount of impact. You get to decide what it means for you, but it must be built on truth to be sustainable. And so if you're listening to this and you're going through a period, or you've been through a period recently where it's felt like a shedding, like Jessica talked about, where it's felt like. Oh my gosh. These relationships that were once my backbone or that were my closest circle, like they've been released or Michelle talked about dismantling her entire company a few years ago, or maybe it just feels like what once was stable and solid and part of your life no longer is or is changing form. There is a stripping away. Things that is happening so that you can be clear and free and ready to build something based on truth, which, like Jessica said, that's where the magic happens. That's where we can build and scale. And Michelle, you shared now on the other side of that, what it's like to be. company where things are aligned and things are moving and it's a very different energetic and so we wanna support a very intimate, special group of women in building their personal empire based on full alignment, full freedom, full truth. And I think we're all big believers and women get to have it all.
Elyse Archer: Whatever that looks like for you. I personally, I'm a mom of three kids, five and under, I run a company that does multimillions in sales. Every year in part-time hours, like you and I've been through the stripping, I've been through the challenges I like. It's not all like easy peasy all the time.
Elyse Archer: I get it. And what I believe in and crave and seek more than ever now is truth, freedom, expansion, love, joy in my life. That is what matters. If we wanna create a space where women can come in and have the business and money support the energetic embodiment. The identity, the clearing of anything that no longer serves each of us brings a unique angle to that.
Elyse Archer: And so it's a mastermind that's gonna support you in really in ascending to your highest level and kind and having the three of our energy really focused on each of the women in this Mastermind to create your most expansive vision, step into it, and then live it, be actually living it by the end of six months. Yeah, and there's more.
Laura D: Oh my God.
Elyse Archer: It's all
Laura D: Oh,
Elyse Archer: Laura, are
Laura D: just.
Elyse Archer: I love you.
Laura D: I'm sweating. I'm sweating.
Elyse Archer: That's how we feel about it how we
Laura D: Um, That's when I, when I'm connected and I'm feeling truth, I like start to sweat. So I'm like kind of regretting this. Sweatshirt situation. I'm feeling the truth.
Elyse Archer: Jessica.
Laura D: I know, I'm feeling the truth of what you're saying. And listeners, I know these three personally, and this is why I've been bugging them.
Laura D: I'm like, you, you don't understand. It's gonna be so good, the Empire Mastermind. And, uh, if, if people are curious, wanna know more about it how could they do that? And of course, listeners will put it in the show notes.
Elyse Archer: they can DM any of us. So I'm assuming we'll link our socials
Laura D: Yes.
Elyse Archer: empire mastermind.com is where you can go to apply. So it is application only. And we will, and again, you can connect with us on social, you can send us a note but we are kicking off the Mastermind in early 2026.
Elyse Archer: And so now is your time. If you are interested, if you want to apply, come connect. Let's talk about what you're building and how we can help
Laura D: Oh my God.
Elyse Archer: it.
Laura D: So good. I'm sweating. Thank you. Thank you for that.
Laura D: I have one final question. Elyse, you can, I hope you answer differently just for fun, that I ask all my guests. I don't even know if you remember the question. Do you remember
Elyse Archer: No. No.
Laura D: great. Great. The fact that you don't remember is great.
Laura D: Okay. If you were an item in a coffee shop, so like a drink a pastry, I mean, you could be the, you can be the calendar. I don't know. Somebody said the calendar by the way, funny. Uh, what would you be and why?
Elyse Archer: Okay.
Michelle: Ooh,
Elyse Archer: Michelle, you wanna go first?
Michelle: can I go?
Elyse Archer: Yeah, go.
Michelle: a chocolate covered espresso bean.
Laura D: That is what Elyse said.
Michelle: No. Stop it.
Laura D: That
Michelle: Stop
Laura D: whatever episode that is what she,
Michelle: Okay. Because I'm sweet and bold all at the same time.
jessica: Oh my gosh.
Laura D: I can't,
Michelle: this is, this is what happens with us,
jessica: Yeah. Yeah.
Michelle: an
Laura D: I believe it.
Michelle: explain. It's so connected. This is what happens. I can't
Laura D: I'm sweating, so I'm sweating so bad. Yeah. No, that's, that's, it's not even a drink. It's not, I have a feeling like behind the scenes, your guides were like, they need extra support. Laura has no shame and will text them. I think I was, I think that's what happened. They're like, she will, she doesn't care. She has no qualms, and I don't.
Laura D: Okay.
Michelle: Wow.
Laura D: trippy. That's amazing.
Michelle: Elyse you have to pick a different one now.
Elyse Archer: I, okay, so first of all, I love that. Yes, that's a line. All right. This time I would be one of the, I'd be a cute bougie mug because I've been in a mode lately where
Laura D: Love.
Elyse Archer: my, I intuitively let myself just pick whatever mug speaks to me most and I can feel my energy and my vibe based on the mug, if that makes sense.
Elyse Archer: So we're gonna go with that, but I'll still be next to you in the espresso beam packaged Michelle.
jessica: I'll just tell you the first thing that came to me, and it's weird. It's weird, but I'm weird. The, that I'm like the security camera.
Laura D: Ooh. Oh my God. I love this.
jessica: I dunno why. Okay. So I just feel like I would wanna be the security camera in the coffee shop because I feel like there's so many, so many people in there like thinking and doing so many things, and I love to observe. I love to observe people and like the looks on their faces, even like before they give their order or what they're thinking about.
jessica: I don't know. I know that sounds a little corny and weird, but.
Laura D: I love it. I love that the three of you, none of you picked a drink. That's my favorite part. All right. Thank you so much, Elyse, Jessica, Michelle. I said that out of order. Jessica, Elyse and Michelle. J.E.M.. J.E.M.,
Laura D: Thank you.
Laura D: so much. I'm so honored. I'm so honored to have the three of you at the same time.
Laura D: I'm so honored to know each of you personally and I am really excited about this Empire Mastermind listeners. Check that out, that
Michelle: much for having us.
jessica: Thank
Laura D: Thank you.
Big thanks again to Jessica Papano, Elise Archer, and Michelle Schon for sharing their stories so openly. These conversations are such a reminder that no pivot is too messy, too late, or too unconventional. If something she said resonated, don't keep it to yourself. Share this episode with someone you know who needs it, and when you are ready to start your own pivot.
Head to www.leadinact.com for free resources or book a free 20 minute call with me. I'm here for you.